Dalibor Norský

* 1931

  • „Tak já jsem si říkal, že to jsou důvody, marná sláva. Ale pořád jsem se snažil je nějakým způsobem přechytračit. Jednou mě to napadlo, když jsem jednal s velitelem protiletadlového pluku. Říkal jsem mu: 'Ty, Vladimíre - on se jmenoval Vladimír Smirnov, podplukovník – za jak dlouho je tvůj pluk bojeschopný, když se vyhlásí poplach?' On říkal, že během dvaceti minut. Já povídal: 'Nedělej to složité, vyhlas poplach pluku a můžete jet.' Samozřejmě vím, že je něco jiného poplach a něco jiného odsun. Ale takovým způsobem jsem se jim snažil říct, že je to složitě dělané. V průběhu dalších jednání mě napadla taková, nechci říct geniální, ale dobrá myšlenka. Oni pořád říkali, že nemůžou odjet, že je něco třeba spravit, že mají špatné tanky, že je musí dát dohromady. Říkal jsem: 'Podívejte, že opustíte střední Evropu, to je jasné. A jsou v ní stovky tisíc sovětských vojáků a stovky posádek. A to všechno se postěhuje do Sovětského svazu. Když se seberete a budete doma co nejdříve, přijdete do kamenných kasáren, kde vás ubytují. Nebudete muset dělat stany na poli. Tím pádem získáte úžasné výhody.' To zabralo. Já viděl, jak po sobě koukali. Jako by si říkali, že ten člověk má pravdu. Potom se jednání uvolnila. Už jezdili do Olomouce, kde měli divizi a zřejmě netrvali na tom, že zůstanou ve Frenštátě. Tím pádem se to dotáhlo tak daleko, že šli první.“

  • „Dlužno říct, že jednání s Rusákama šlo ztuha. Oni tady měli Ameriku. Pro ně Česká republika opravdu byla Amerika, tak tady chtěli být co nejdéle, ne-li zůstat. A my zase chtěli, aby vypadli co nejdříve. Tak jsme se pořád střetávali. Pak jsem chodil na posádku často, protože mi říkali, abych s posádkou navázal styky. Tak jsem tam chodil každý den, abych věděl, co se tam děje. Jestli už něco dělají nebo čekají, až zahřmí. Já jsme je otravoval už od prosince. V lednu došlo k setkání skupin, ale šlo to strašně ztuha. Oni se vymlouvali, že mají hodně techniky, hodně vojska, že to není jednoduché dát dohromady. Vydat rozkaz k opuštění prostor pro ně bylo nemyslitelné.“

  • „V prosinci 1989 jsem psal memorandum Frenštáčanů, které jsme poslali na ústředí Občanského fóra do Prahy. Že už jsme navázali kontakt s ruskou posádkou, že chceme aby, když už ne vojáci, tak aspoň rodinní příslušníci okamžitě odešli. A protože jsem to napsal, už jsem musel jednat. Taky že jo. Když přišli na městský úřad, oni jednali pořád se starostou, já jsem se tam vnutil. Řekl jsem jim, že jsem zástupce Občanského fóra a že s nimi budu jednat ohledně odsunu vojsk. Oni říkali, že dobře, ale že to budeme dělat v kasárnách. Já říkal: 'Ne, my do žádných kasáren chodit nebudeme vy budete chodit sem na radnici a tady budeme jednat o odsunu'.“

  • „But it was difficult, terribly tough. Of course they didn’t want to leave and wished to stay for as long as possible. And we wanted them to pack up and go as soon as possible. Well as it clashed, there was no space for anyone. They kept saying the same thing, as the lieutenant colonel Smirnov, he was the deputy head and the anti-aircraft regiment commander, we were already on informal terms, he used to say: ‚Dalibor, eto něpajďot, očeň mnoho těchniky, očeň vremja nado.‘ I said: ‚Well, look, that cannot go on, you need to leave already.‘ I told him it was an international decision, such was the situation. Gorbačov, Reagan, it was not sustainable. And he replied: ‚Ok, but it will last a year or two to prepare for us to go.‘ And I said that was not possible. And the negotiations with others, we were discussing the state of the flats that they had to leave. But they were leaving it in the state they took them over from the barracks. Plus the big cockroaches were here too. Well that was something truly terrible. We had two, three or four meetings on the issue and always agreed they will start preparations. I attended them on a daily basis. Though I was the head of the cleaner´s service, but was not there much. I was always in the barracks and promised myself to watch over them. I was worried that they would not move at all. I did not want to let them drink their vodka and just hang around.“

  • “Well, Vlasta, she was three years older and didn’t finish it and got married in 1948. And I finished the eighth grade and then just a couple of days prior to the so called saint week the class professor Hýža came to us and said he had news for our class. He was our class teacher. And the news was that Dalibor Norský was no allowed to graduate at all. I just stared at him astonished. The reason was political unconsciousness and unawareness. So I stood up, recovered from the surprise as I really didn’t expect it. And I replied that the political unconsciousness was an acceptable reason. But not political ignorance, I could not agree to that. As I was well informed. And I sat down.“

  • “Gradually, how many were they in the regiment, two or three thousand men maximally. But gradually as their families arrived, all this was of course 90 per cent occupied by Russians. All those flats built up here and opposite to the church as well. There were many flats here and our people could not use them. And the Russians had a condition that a couple of Czech families stayed there. Just to prevent any attacks or terror. They were protecting themselves in the way that the Czech family secures no one throwing a grenade; that was how they imagined our counter-revolution. So when they brought their families here, then of course the aversion on part of the citizens was even bigger. As they had enough money and the currency course was fine for them. The women didn’t work at all. In the morning they went shopping for goods and got everything. Our women went back from the factory in the afternoon as they had to work like men did to secure their existence. And there was nothing in the shops at all. They could not get any butter and other stuff. Nowadays you don’t even realise how tough the times were back then.“

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    Frenštát pod Radhoštěm, 03.03.2017

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    Ostrava, 25.04.2019

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    Ostrava, 06.05.2019

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I told myself that the Russian soldiers will leave first here out of our country. And I suceeded.

A portrait of the witness in 1960s
A portrait of the witness in 1960s
photo: archiv pamětníka

Dalibor Norský was born on 22 July, 1931 in Košice as Dalibor Neumann. His father accepted the surname Norský after 1945, when people were often changing their German names to the Czech ones. The father was a lieutenant of the Czechoslovak army. The family with a total of five children had to move due to work and finally settled down in Frenštát pod Radhoštěm. Following February 1948 the father was released from the army and made his living as a manual worker. In 1949 Dalibor´s sister Květa was sentenced in a political process to nine years in prison. Her husband, a layer, Josef Hampl, was imprisoned for ten years. Persecution of his relatives caused Dalibor a strong repulsion against the communists. He apprentices a turner. He also worked in a factory MEZ in Frenštát pod Radhoštěm and as a tractor driver. In November 1989 he became one of the founding members of the Civic Forum in Frenštát. He was in charge of the Soviet troops negotiations, which was present in the town since 1968. He was annoyed by the foreign army presence. His goal was to get the Soviet soldiers first out of all the units in the former Czechoslovakia. Following long negotiations, which he personally led with the Soviet leaders, he succeeded. On February 26th, 1990 the removal of the Soviet regiment from Frenštát began and other regiments gradually left the republic. He earned a good reputation in Frenštát pod Radhoštěm due to his victory and is ascribed the primacy in the field.